and you thought you knew.. Symphony in DeMeanor
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'If no one knows who you are, you need to reach out and find the listeners.. they won’t find you - at least not initially (no one knows who you are, remember?) So it takes good old fashioned leg work, a lot of which can fortunately be done at a computer terminal. Like I said before, the Internet has shrunk the world and it’s easier to reach out to people. '
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In our second interview with Rob Vermeulen of Symphony in DeMeanor, almost two years after 'The First One' was released, we got Rob to tell us about the band's magnifcent new mini-album 'The Second One' and their efforts to get themselves noticed especially in terms of internet promotions. We think Rob's honest and positive attitude to recording, production, and promotion is something we can all learn from and perhaps one of the reasons why Symphony in DeMeanor have become a flagship to where alot of indie bands need to be these days. As Rob points out however, great compliments and prasie and appreciation in the form of great reviews and awards can constitute a kind of pressure and expectation as well as a sense of reward for all the hard work involved in producing 'magnificent' music. For Symphony in DeMeanor.. these things now go hand in hand but the bottom line is as it's always been... that this band have few equals in their genre and, with the release of 'The Second One' I don't mind saying that they've gone and surpassed all of our expectations completely!
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The Second Interview - June 2006 |
| Nice to have you back at IOM Rob. At long last you’ve managed to put out another six track mini album ‘The Second One’ which I have to say is an absolutely magnificent piece of work all round. How different was the approach, from the band’s perspective, to this project compared to when the First One was produced? |
First of all, many thanks for the kind words about the album, it means a lot! The Second One has Bruce as a songwriter as well, which is really nice. The First One was songs only written by Tom and myself, except for the White Rabbit cover. Fortunately we’re all on the same page pretty much, so our sound is still consistent throughout the album. I think we tied all the songs and sounds together nicely on this one. |
| Since the IOM review of The Second One, I’ve been dying to ask you about ‘Let the children play’ what can you tell us about how the track came about and how it was recorded? |
Musically, Let The Children Play started out with a riff and structure that Bruce was working on. He and Tom worked on the music and I started writing lyrics that were inspired by a presentation I’d attended which was about how the “corporate world” was marketing to our children, and using sex and violence in their marketing campaigns. It was then recorded, same as the others….and a lot of coffee on mix day…We were all really happy with how it turned out. |
| Overall, was there anything strikingly different about the technical recording aspects of ‘The Second One’ compared to the way ‘The First One’ was produced? |
Not that much really. On The First One we recorded a lot to A-Dat, whereas The Second One went straight to a hard drive. In terms of the actual recording/mixing process though, they were both pretty much the same. We used Beatty Lane Studios for the rhythm tracks on both, and Craig Waddell at Gotham City Studios was the mastering engineer for both.
We had technical glitches on The First One, and true to form, we had technical glitches on The Second One, but we survived both. We’ll save the details until years from now, when we can laugh about them (smiles) |
| Overall, how much difference have your own promotional efforts made in getting Symphony in DeMeanor heard and what would you advise for others in their promotional efforts especially where their budgets might be limited? |
You hear the phrase “time and money” a lot in many endeavours. So if you don’t have money, you have to spend the time. A lot of it!
If no one knows who you are, you need to reach out and find the listeners, they won’t find you, at least not initially (no one knows who you are, remember?) So it takes good old fashioned leg work, a lot of which can fortunately be done at a computer terminal. Like I said before, the Internet has shrunk the world and it’s easier to reach out to people.
There are numerous OMD’s out there now. Put your music on them. There are numerous music forums and discussion groups. Join them. Be sincere and genuine in your endeavours. If you’re just out there for yourself, that attitude will get discovered pretty quickly. If you say you’re going to do something, do it. It’s hard to gain people’s trust, even harder to get it back once you’ve lost it!!
Put together a mailing list of people/places that will likely review your music. Send them a CD!! An email telling them where to download your tracks won’t cut it. It’s unprofessional, and most won’t do it!
If you’re serious about wanting a review (or airplay), send the CD. So many bands get caught up being stingy with their product, no one ever hears about it. Get it out there!!! Give it a life of its own! Yes, it’ll cost you postage and some CD’s, but the return is well worth it!
Also, recognize who your target audience is, and spend your time marketing to them. If your music is heavy metal for instance, don’t waste time and effort joining the Barry Manilow Forum and asking people there to listen to your stuff.
And finally, don’t get discouraged. Most importantly, don’t be afraid to ask people for things. The worst that can happen is they say ‘no’. Big deal. The Indie community is pretty supportive of one another too, so you can find a lot of good info from fellow artists. |
| So, drawing from that experience, is there anything you’re doing differently in promoting ‘The Second One’? |
| No, we do everything I’ve just mentioned. I dug out the old mailing list and sent The Second One CD’s off to everyone again, and we’re waiting to hear their comments. So far it’s been positive and we’re quite pleased. |
| Symphony in DeMeanor has received relatively widespread acclaim from reviews to awards, how much difference has this made in motivating the band in particular? |
I have to say we write/record for ourselves. And by that I mean, we want to finish with a product that we’re proud of, and that we want to hear. We don’t write with the intent to please anyone other than ourselves. I think once you try writing to please someone else, you lose your creativity somewhat, and that’s very limiting. So when we receive accolades for what we’ve done, be it Awards or good reviews etc.. it’s immensely rewarding!! It kind of says to us that others feel the same way about the music that we do and it’s very validating. I think as human beings, we all appreciate a pat on the back for something we’ve done, and Symphony in DeMeanor are no different. |
| In your last interview, you mentioned ‘Another Birthday’ from ‘the First One’ was a firm favourite. Do you have a particularly favourite track from the new album? |
Again I’m really pleased with how all the tracks turned out. If we had doubts about any of them, we wouldn’t release them. That’s kind of where the 6 track album came from for us. We always said “no album filler” !! Having said that, our next release looks like it will be a full length album…. But with NO filler (laughs). My personal favourite changes every time I hear the album, but right now I’m really liking 'Dreams'. |
| From my view of ‘The Second One’, I can see that the band has not only developed in terms of musicianship and as composers, but also as very fine producers. So I can say with confidence, that had Symphony in DeMeanor been responsible for producing Paul McCartney’s last album ‘Chaos and Creation in the Backyard’ for instance, then our Paul would quite probably have ended up with another classic? I guess what I’m saying is that if that kind of view is frustrating to me… then what could it be like for you knowing perhaps, that you really have become seriously accomplished producers in your own right? |
Well, that’s a huge compliment and we thank you very much for that. We truly enjoy creating and producing music that we’d like to hear. I guess if there’s a frustration, then it’s simply just that it’s a slow process ‘getting the word out’, and that’s where the Indie world is a bit more difficult than having the marketing power of a record label behind you. |
| I don’t know of many ‘indie’ artists that could be put on that kind of 'producer pedestal' but if you look at the quality in production on ‘the Second One’ and the quality in Nigel Godrich’s work for McCartney's album I think a lot of people would agree and to my mind at least, there’s some kind of issue in that! |
I’m not sure there’s an issue in it, really. I have that album and I respect what Nigel did. To me it’s a far better album than 'Driving Rain' (which I don’t own). We fully expect Paul to call us though, to produce his next one (laughing). Seriously, we really appreciate the huge compliment you’ve given us, and now we’re feeling all kinds of pressure about our next release (smiling). |
That's great Rob... I can accept some responsibiliy then for 'enhancing' the next album... what a buzz!!!
Ok.. let's take a look at location for a moment.. now seeing that your based in Vancouver, (in BC, Canada)… how’s the music scene down there at the moment and how would you say the band is doing in Canada compared to other countries? |
I’d say we’re more popular the farther from Canada you can get (laughing). The music scene typically eats their own, so trying to succeed in your own area can sometimes be tough. I think we’re actually more successful in the U.K. and Europe than here though. Russia and Japan are also very warm to new music. And there’s a little town in Holland called Koog a/d Zaan where I have some distant relatives that like our music (smiles). |
| I have to confess Rob that I’m not that impressed with the strength of the independent music scene on the West Coast when you compare it to ‘the other side’ nearer Ontario for example.. |
| Maybe bands from Ontario are just better at getting their music ‘out there’, who knows. I’ve heard great music from artists all over the world, so I don’t think where you’re from matters much anymore. Especially these days, with the Internet. The world has shrunk considerably. |
| I think it's also true that Vancouver and Toronto in particular have a heavier concentration of media and industry presence for film, music, and studios and labels. On the digital distribution side of things, do you think the emergence and escalating success of iTunes and others can benefit indie artists in ways that surpass the old high street distribution way of doing things or do you think high street is still the way forward for indie labels and artists? |
I think iTunes and similar is the way the industry seems to be going. I don’t think, however, that you can ever replace “the Album”. iTunes is like buying a 45 rpm single, which people did when they knew the rest of the album sucked, or because the album wasn’t out yet. Put out a great “album” and I think people will still want the album. There’s nothing like having the actual product in hand but digital distribution is the future for sure.
I do smile though, that as far as we have come digitally, there are still people that like vinyl…. |
I will still pick up a vinyl album or 45 for the nostalgia or sentiment.. and I actually picked up a nice turntable at a garage sale last year but it still needs a new cartridge that I haven't got around to buying yet!
OK back to Symphony in Demeanor… what are your plans for the rest of this year? |
We’re actually writing material for the next release right now. So the rest of the year will be working on the next album!! We’ve demo'd a couple and are loving how it sounds and like I said, it’s going to be a full length monstrosity!
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| Rob… it’s been a pleasure as always, it's been great catching up so thanks for stopping by and good luck with the Second One and the rest of 2006! |
| Many, many thanks, the pleasure was mine. |
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Rob Vermeulen of Symphony in Demeanor was interviewed by Colin Lynch - June 10 2004
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